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	<title>Beer Viking &#187; brewers</title>
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		<title>The 2010 Battersea Beer Festival &#8211; a short review</title>
		<link>http://www.beerviking.com/2010/02/the-2010-battersea-beer-festival-a-short-review/</link>
		<comments>http://www.beerviking.com/2010/02/the-2010-battersea-beer-festival-a-short-review/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Feb 2010 10:09:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Doc D</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Beer Festival]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[London, UK]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Real Posts]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[American Beer]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Battersea Beer Festival]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[Belgian Beers]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[Hop Aroma]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.beerviking.com/2010/02/the-2010-battersea-beer-festival-a-short-review/</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The 2010 edition of the Battersea Beer Festival in London (Feb ) was another solid event. A great selection of UK craft beer and reasonable International stand of mainly Belgian and German beers. However, I didn&#39;t find a single American beer on site &#8211; buy maybe I missed something. I was down on the landlord and brewer day which was [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div class='posterous_autopost'>
<div>The <a>2010 edition of the Battersea Beer Festival</a> in London (Feb ) was another solid event. A great selection of UK craft beer and reasonable International stand of mainly Belgian and German beers. However, I didn&#39;t find a single American beer on site &#8211; buy maybe I missed something.</div>
<p />
<div>I was down on the landlord and brewer day which was cool as I ran into Downton&#39;s head brewer and the landlord of<a href="http://www.legothique.co.uk/Welcome_.html"> La Gothique</a> (home of the Wandsworth Common Beer Festival held at the end of March &#8211; you can <a href="http://www.beerviking.com/wcbf/tickets">pre-book tickets HERE!</a>).</div>
<p />
<div>Here&#39;s what I sampled on the day:</div>
<div>
<ul>
<li><a href="http://www.westerhambrewery.co.uk/">Westerham</a> Grasshopper Bitter 3.8% &#8211; 15/20, solid session bitter nice hop aroma, smooth (btw &#8211; one of favourite brewers in the UK!)</li>
<li>Kelda Gole 4% &#8211; 14/20, nice goledn dry bitter</li>
<li>Bazens Pacific Biiter &#8211; 13/14, drinkable</li>
<li>Bowman Quiver 4.5% &#8211; 14/20 really nice earthy bite and hoppy finish</li>
<li>Downton IPA 6.8% &#8211; only 12/20 needs work, other beer from this brewer much better</li>
<li>Also, got a few tasty beer from the international stand to take home (pls see photo)</li>
</ul>
</div>
<div>My overall view is that the Battersea rates a 7 out of 10 for beer festivals. For my taste its a bit &#39;old school&#39; and cramped in terms of space. Not a criticism but just my impression. There&#39;s also a lack of woman and the food is mediocre at best. At leasts its easy to get to being only a 10 minute walk from Clapham Junction. I will most likely go back next year&#8230;</div>
<p />
<p />
<p><a href='http://posterous.com/getfile/files.posterous.com/beerviking/RzV5chvQJ8XdLQ2iLIewVdNcrhg3ifYHFVhIjRvVP44XfATguWCMSUauSyEf/Battersea2010_1.jpg'><img src="http://posterous.com/getfile/files.posterous.com/beerviking/NP9vo0xcqR6ZcSOyia7XqB2CNtcuAEjyFnGBTtXydbg2yMDAqvN5kn2zQ3h3/Battersea2010_1.jpg.scaled.500.jpg" width="500" height="375"/></a> <a href='http://posterous.com/getfile/files.posterous.com/beerviking/MNzSdgV4TET4Qa7ayoU7rS4FulURj8RiE4W2Cr7QfxsfsxfwZvck5f2jeuhp/Battersea2010_2.jpg'><img src="http://posterous.com/getfile/files.posterous.com/beerviking/RPiRMwp2rBKb79Kzvnipd85TAcYVrT5ZMWtl6EZgnZ04lyzN23uki3Cbc4Af/Battersea2010_2.jpg.scaled.500.jpg" width="500" height="375"/></a> <a href='http://posterous.com/getfile/files.posterous.com/beerviking/SSv7g5MZQk2vlcxIZ65OgI4p7vw4eaPF7j9RZ18VOzaHHqHDPlYE93rtSVM3/Battersea2010_takeawaybeers.jpg'><img src="http://posterous.com/getfile/files.posterous.com/beerviking/4UeYOiaUVcEPlu8cNAk4ZEJwfstUzdESrDU3GYA0IhlUhOsRHJ0D91PRQgGA/Battersea2010_takeawaybeers.jpg.scaled.500.jpg" width="500" height="375"/></a>
<div><a href='http://beerviking.posterous.com/the-2010-battersea-beer-festival-a-short-revi'>See and download the full gallery on posterous</a></div>
</p>
<p style="font-size: 10px;">  <a href="http://posterous.com">Posted via email</a>   from <a href="http://beerviking.posterous.com/the-2010-battersea-beer-festival-a-short-revi">beerviking&#8217;s posterous</a>  </p>
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		<title>Christmas Cracker 2009</title>
		<link>http://www.beerviking.com/2009/12/christmas-cracker-2009/</link>
		<comments>http://www.beerviking.com/2009/12/christmas-cracker-2009/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Dec 2009 21:35:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thetank</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Beer]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Real Posts]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Taste-off]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Anchor]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Borough Market]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[brewers]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Celebration]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Cheese]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Christmas Cracker]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Cold Night]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Crowd]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Desire]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Excitement]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Glyn Davies]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Kegs]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Landmark]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Otley]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Palate]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Pliny The Elder]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Quality Beers]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Rake]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Sierra Nevada]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Sweet Spots]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Two Captains]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.beerviking.com/2009/12/christmas-cracker-2009/</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In a time honoured tradition, the Beer Viking crew recently had their annual Christmas Cracker.  Sometimes we get more organised and arrange a pub crawl and send out invites and sometimes it’s just the two captains, Doc and Tank, trying as many quality beers as possible.  On that point, it really is about enjoying beer [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img style="display: inline; border-width: 0px;" title="Chirstmas Cracker" src="http://www.beerviking.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/181118_5651.jpg" border="0" alt="Chirstmas Cracker" width="123" height="164" /></p>
<p>In a time honoured tradition, the Beer Viking crew recently had their annual Christmas Cracker.  Sometimes we get more organised and arrange a pub crawl and send out invites and sometimes it’s just the two captains, Doc and Tank, trying as many quality beers as possible.  On that point, it really is about enjoying beer for what it is, a great beverage.  At the end of year of hard tasting, one’s palate and desire to enjoy a beer can get a bit jaded and so this is the kind of line under the year kind of thing.</p>
<p>2009 was along the unorganised, if you like unplanning line and as you’ll see below we had some incredible beers.</p>
<p>Doc had recently been on a <a href="http://www.beerviking.com/?s=%22west+coast+raid%22&amp;x=0&amp;y=0&amp;=Go">mini-raid of California</a>, where he managed to hit up some sweet spots and uncover <a href="http://twitter.com/beervikingcrew/status/6550815142">a great joint near Los Angeles</a>.  I got a text from him on the way to the airport and it was such a delight to read.  One bottle of <a href="http://www.russianriverbrewing.com/web/brews/plinytheelder.htm">Pliny the Elder</a> is coming back for us to share.  We discussed various options and then went for a landmark shot, which you can see a picture of below.  It meant that the drinking conditions were sub-optimal but for such a rare treat as a fresh <a href="http://www.russianriverbrewing.com/web/brews/plinytheelder.htm">Pliny the Elder</a> in the UK, it was worth it.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.beerviking.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/PlineyInLondon.jpg"><img style="display: inline; border-width: 0px;" title="Pliny the Elder in front of Tower Bridge" src="http://www.beerviking.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/PlineyInLondon_thumb.jpg" border="0" alt="Pliny the Elder in front of Tower Bridge" width="337" height="254" /></a></p>
<p>From here, we walked through the wet and cold night to <a href="http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=54192620280">the Rake</a>, with full intentions of carrying on from there.  It turned out Borough Market was having a bit of cheese night and so it was a slightly different crowd than normal.  A couple of nights previous the <a href="http://www.otleybrewing.co.uk/">Otley</a> brewers were in, with a special they had brewed with Glyn <span style="text-decoration: line-through;">Davies</span> Roberts, the Rake manager.  Most of the beer had been drunk but lucky for us the Otley O Ho H was on cask.  I’m a big fan of this beer and Doc D was quick to give his thumbs up.</p>
<p>This was soon followed by bottles of the Anchor Christmas ‘09 (angled for by Doc due to his excitement of his Anchor Brewery Tour the week before) and the Sierra Nevada Celebration ‘08.  Which reminded me that on my previous days visit, I had been told that a couple of kegs of ‘09 were downstairs.  A quick word with <a href="http://magicdave6.hoppress.com/">Tom</a> and at the first opportunity this was on and soon we were having some pints of this tasty seasonal brew.</p>
<p>Next was the Brooklyn Winter and Great Divide Hibernation, during which we had some more conversations with Tom and soon the decision was made to share some further bounty raided in NORCAL.  Some choice cans, yes you read that right, CANS of beers.  Soon we had set up camp on by the brewers signature wall and were making our way through 21st Ammendment IPA, 21st Ammendment Monks Blood and Big Sky Brewing Co. Moose Drool.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.beerviking.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/BVXmasCrack1.jpg"><img style="display: inline; border-width: 0px;" title="Sharing cans of quality craft beer at the Christmas Cracker 09" src="http://www.beerviking.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/BVXmasCrack1_thumb.jpg" border="0" alt="Sharing cans of quality craft beer at the Christmas Cracker 09" width="304" height="229" /></a></p>
<p>It was at this point things started to go off the boil but we all agreed that it was a pleasant surprise to have just tasty beers out of cans.  Reminders of <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0_GNNw6s4Q">teenage kicks</a>, thankfully Doc had ignored my earlier suggestion on first viewing the cans as an opportunity to do a couple of shotguns.  We followed this up with the Great Divide Denver Pale Ale, which is the point where all brewrank scores stopped for the night.</p>
<p>We made our way through the rare treat to most, even more special in Europe, Moonlight Death &amp; Taxes.  We then had to taste one of my favourite Christmas beers of all time, De Dolle Stille Nacht.  Then onto the Great Divide Fresh Hop ‘09 and finishing with the Goose Island Christmas.</p>
<p>There may have been a few more to round out the night, like I’m thinking the Dark Star Imperial on cask but can’t be sure as this is where the notes and the memory stopped.  All in all, a wonderful and solid Christmas Cracker ‘09.  Hope you can join us next year but for now, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.</p>
<p>The list in full:</p>
<ol>
<li>Pliny the Elder</li>
<li>Otley O Ho Ho</li>
<li>Anchor Chrismtas ‘09</li>
<li>Sierra Nevada Celebration ‘08</li>
<li>Sierra Nevada Celebration ‘09</li>
<li>Brooklyn Winter</li>
<li>Great Divide Hibernation</li>
<li>21st Ammendment IPA</li>
<li>21st Ammendment Monks Blood</li>
<li>Big Sky Brewing Co. Moose Drool</li>
<li>Great Divide Denver Pale</li>
<li>Moonlight Death &amp; Taxes</li>
<li>Stille Nacht</li>
<li>Great Divide Harvest 09</li>
<li>Goose Island Christmas</li>
</ol>
<p><a href="http://www.beerviking.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/BVXmasCrack2.jpg"><img style="display: inline; border-width: 0px;" title="Almost the end of the night for the Christmas Cracker" src="http://www.beerviking.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/BVXmasCrack2_thumb.jpg" border="0" alt="Almost the end of the night for the Christmas Cracker" width="229" height="304" /></a></p>
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		<title>More on the Dark Star, Thornbridge Mashup</title>
		<link>http://www.beerviking.com/2009/03/more-on-the-dark-star-thornbridge-mashup/</link>
		<comments>http://www.beerviking.com/2009/03/more-on-the-dark-star-thornbridge-mashup/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Mar 2009 19:53:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thetank</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Beer]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[Long Time]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Maris Otter]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[pale ale]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.beerviking.com/2009/03/more-on-the-dark-star-thornbridge-mashup/</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[As first read about from beermerchants. Dropped in at the Evening Star (caught the tail end of the Six Hop availability) and they had some more details on the collaboration between Dark Star and Thornbridge. Mark Tranter headed North to wonderful Derbyshire.&#160; It&#8217;s a 7% Old Ale using Maris Otter Pale Ale, Crystal Malts with [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img style="border-right-width: 0px; display: inline; border-top-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px" title="Dark Star" border="0" alt="Dark Star" src="http://www.beerviking.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/bartowel07.jpg" width="200" height="92" /> <a href="http://www.beerviking.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/brewcrew.jpg"><img style="border-bottom: 0px; border-left: 0px; display: inline; border-top: 0px; border-right: 0px" title="brewcrew" border="0" alt="brewcrew" src="http://www.beerviking.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/brewcrew-thumb.jpg" width="128" height="92" /></a> </p>
<p>As first read about from <a href="http://twitter.com/beermerchants/statuses/1253933966">beermerchants</a>. Dropped in at the Evening Star (caught the tail end of the <a href="http://www.ratebeer.com/Ratings/Beer/Beer-Ratings.asp?BeerID=83718">Six Hop</a> availability) and they had some more details on the collaboration between <a href="http://www.darkstarbrewing.co.uk/">Dark Star</a> and <a href="http://www.thornbridgebrewery.co.uk/">Thornbridge</a>.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.wine-spirit.com/articles/46004/Meet-the-brewer-Mark-Tranter-Dark-Star-Brewery.aspx?categoryid=282">Mark Tranter</a> headed North to wonderful Derbyshire.&#160; It&#8217;s a 7% Old Ale using Maris Otter Pale Ale, Crystal Malts with Aurora, Atlas and Liberty hops. </p>
<p>There is talk about watching the development and potentially adding things along the way&#8230; </p>
<p>The great news for me is that it&#8217;s going to be available in bottles.</p>
<p>From the list of ingredients and what I know of these brewers, I’m thinking this will a wonderful rich dark beer with a great length where the hops are there very quickly staying with you for a long time after your ‘sup.</p>
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		<title>Exmoor Beast, 6.6%. A dark Por&#8230;</title>
		<link>http://www.beerviking.com/2009/01/exmoor-beast-66-a-dark-por/</link>
		<comments>http://www.beerviking.com/2009/01/exmoor-beast-66-a-dark-por/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 14:37:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Twitter</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Twitter]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[Exmoor Beast, 6.6%. A dark Porter-style with nice upnotes from: Goldings, Challenger and Brewers Gold hops. 15/20]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Exmoor Beast, 6.6%. A dark Porter-style with nice upnotes from: Goldings, Challenger and Brewers Gold hops. 15/20</p>
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		<title>Christmas Beer &#8211; Weltons Imperial Festive 2008</title>
		<link>http://www.beerviking.com/2008/12/christmas-beer-weltons-imperial-festive-2008/</link>
		<comments>http://www.beerviking.com/2008/12/christmas-beer-weltons-imperial-festive-2008/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Dec 2008 13:53:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thetank</dc:creator>
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		<description><![CDATA[Oh my, this is my 2nd bottle of this.&#160; First one I wasn’t able to take notes as I’m still not sure of the etiquette of taking notes when drinking socially with people you don’t know so well. And this bottle conditioned beauty is wonderful and goes straight to the top of the charts of [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh my, this is my 2nd bottle of this.&#160; First one I wasn’t able to take notes as I’m still not sure of the etiquette of taking notes when drinking socially with people you don’t know so well.</p>
<p>And this bottle conditioned beauty is wonderful and goes straight to the top of the charts of my Christmas beers.</p>
<p>It poured a dark reddish colour with almost no head.&#160; You can get the hops and malt right on the nose.</p>
<p>Taste wise, you get some sweetness before the hops kick in and that goes to quite a dry finish with a nice mouthful of yummy making you want even more.</p>
<p>I can’t find any details about this except for on the bottle.&#160; </p>
<p>Weltons Imperial Festive is from <a href="http://www.weltonsbeer.com/">Weltons</a> the Real Ale brewers (again) from Horsham, West Sussex.&#160; Looking at their site you realise that keeping up with their beer production is going to be quite a fun task in itself.</p>
<p>Best before date on my bottle:&#160; 25/12/2009 (love it).</p>
<p>Anyway, here’s what the bottle says:</p>
<blockquote><p>This is a BOTTLE CONDITIONED, mahogany coloured beer, full of rich flavours from the Imperial malts and Admiral hops.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Scores:</p>
<p>Beer 17</p>
<p>Christmas Beer 18</p>
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		<title>De Dolle Brouwers arabier</title>
		<link>http://www.beerviking.com/2008/10/de-dolle-brouwers-arabier/</link>
		<comments>http://www.beerviking.com/2008/10/de-dolle-brouwers-arabier/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:29:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thetank</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Aftertaste]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Aroma]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Beer Lovers]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[brewers]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Crazy Head]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[De Dolle Brouwers]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Grapefruit]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Hop Bitterness]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Kent Goldings]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Malt Beer]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Nugget]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Poperinge]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.beerviking.com/?p=203</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[While spinning some wheels before hitting a train, I dropped by utobeer and asked for some recs to help develop the Belgian pallete. arabier by the De Dolle Brouwers of Essen, Belgium was suggested (also twice by a couple of other punters there) and so it was a definite bring home. There&#8217;s viewing opions about [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.dedollebrouwers.be/"><img class="alignnone" title="De Dolle Brouwers arabier" src="http://www.dedollebrouwers.be/common/arabier1.jpg" alt="" width="227" height="176" /></a></p>
<p>While spinning some wheels before hitting a train, I dropped by <a href="http://www.utobeer.co.uk/">utobeer</a> and asked for some recs to help develop the Belgian pallete.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.dedollebrouwers.be/en/arabier.htm">arabier by the De Dolle Brouwers</a> of Essen, Belgium was suggested (also twice by a couple of other punters there) and so it was a definite bring home.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s viewing opions about what exactly hops are used (<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ara_bier">Kent Goldings</a> vs. <a href="http://www.ratebeer.com/beer/de-dolle-arabier/6873/"><span class="beerfoot">Nugget-hops from Poperinge</span></a>) so here&#8217;s what the brewers say about the beer:</p>
<blockquote><p>An arabier is a pure malt beer 8°vol/alc brewed with flower Nugget-hops from Poperinge. 				It has the special dry-hopping taste and aroma, so appreciated by beer lovers all over the world. 				It is one of the two main beers from De Dolle Brouwers throughout the year. 				Aging time is limited due to the fact that hop bitterness is declining with the time. 				Store arabier cool and dark and serve cool at 10°C. Cheers!</p></blockquote>
<p>With my limited experience, I can tell you the following:</p>
<p>Woah, this suckers pours out with a crazy head so be ready with your glass and take some time.</p>
<p>Taste wise, I get some inital quite mellow bitterness that then builds leaving quite a green, grapefruit hoppy aftertaste that then mellows out leaving you wanting more.</p>
<p>I like it, don&#8217;t think I could sit down and drink them back to back but maybe that&#8217;s the point with these beers.  Will need to get a second opion from the Doc.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Brew-Like-Monk-Trappist-Belgian/dp/093738187X%3FSubscriptionId%3D02E5W5871AJF7PMMMS82%26tag%3Dbeevik-21%26linkCode%3Dxm2%26camp%3D2025%26creative%3D165953%26creativeASIN%3D093738187X"><img src="http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51SDE7VBWDL._SL75_.jpg" alt="" /></a></p>
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		<title>In Search of a Perfect Pint &#8211; The Science</title>
		<link>http://www.beerviking.com/2008/07/in-search-of-a-perfect-pint-the-science/</link>
		<comments>http://www.beerviking.com/2008/07/in-search-of-a-perfect-pint-the-science/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jul 2008 12:28:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thetank</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[brewers]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[mico-brew]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://beerviking.com/?p=68</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Great article in the Independent about the importance and science of good beer making.  Which was published the day that Rob Bell was giving a talk at the RI about the Science of Beer. From reading about the great work Rob is doing at O&#8217;Hanlon Brewing Company including the resurrection of hte Thomas Hardy Ale, [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/how-to-get-a-head-in-search-of-the-perfect-pint-868543.html">Great article</a> in the Independent about the importance and science of good beer making.  Which was published the day that Rob Bell was giving a <a href="http://www.rigb.org/contentControl?action=displayContent&amp;id=830">talk at the RI </a>about the Science of Beer.</p>
<p>From reading about the great work Rob is doing at <a href="http://www.ohanlons.co.uk/page.php?xPage=about_us.php">O&#8217;Hanlon Brewing Company</a> including the resurrection of hte Thomas Hardy Ale, he&#8217;s gone on the Beer Viking wish list for brewers to meet and share a pint with to talk about hops, malt and the whatever else comes to mind.</p>
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